Is Chivalry Dead?

by Lori

Post image for Is Chivalry Dead?

When my niece Jessica (just call her my muse) talked about a discussion she’d had with friends about chivalry being dead or alive and kicking, I decided to research it and see what the general buzz was about chivalry today.

The first thing I learned was how the meaning of the word has evolved. It doesn’t mean what we think it means. Historically, according to Wikipedia, chivalry…

“…is a term related to the medieval institution of knighthood which has an aristocratic military origin of individual training and service to others. Chivalry was also the term used to refer to a group of mounted men-at-arms as well as to martial valour. It is often associated with ideals of knightly virtues, honour and courtly love.”

Of course that’s not what we’re talking about today. In this article entitled The Changing Face of Chivalry the author attributes a modern meaning to the word. But I’d like to take it even further than that.

I’m interested in the spirit of chivalry; what goes beyond it in a meaningful way. The kind of chivalry I’m intrigued with is the kind you can’t teach; the kind that comes from the heart. For instance…

…the kind of chivalry that has my son removing and bunching up his jacket to put it on the hard ceramic floor where I’m about to kneel in church on a day when there are so many people at mass we are sitting in the foyer – with no kneelers.

…the kind of chivalry that has my husband returning his smooth peppermint patty to the box to take instead the last one – the crushed one – leaving the smooth one for me.

There should be a different word for this kind of thought/action. Or maybe together we can give new meaning to the word chivalry.

What’s your take on chivalry? Are you impressed by it, insulted by it? Is chivalry dead?

photo credit: Jeff Kubina

If you enjoyed this post, you will definitely enjoy our others. Feel free to subscribe to the feed via RSS or EMAIL to be updated on all the latest from this blog!

Post comment as twitter logo facebook logo
Sort: Newest | Oldest
saramac 7 pts

I think chivalry for the most part is second nature to some people – and I don’t think it’s necessarily limited to men. I think that it comes down to having respect for people. For example, holding the door open for someone else, I do it as if on instinct. It doesn’t matter whether it’s a male or female, young or old. If I’m standing in line somewhere and I notice that the person behind me only has one thing, I usually tell them to step ahead of me. And it’s surprising the different reactions I receive. A lot of the time, people seem a bit taken aback by me – as if they’re not used to random acts of kindness. However, it’s not necessarily kindness, it’s just doing what I would want someone else to do for me.

Lori 1857 pts moderator

saramac I know what you mean Sara! It's strange how grateful people are when you offer to let them go ahead of you in line. I guess it doesn't happen enough! It's so easy to perform a random act of kindness - it's just not expected these days. Let's change that! :-)

My latest conversation: Are You a Perfectionist?

blogaks 76 pts

Hi Lori,

Chivalry is not very different from love and affection. It is probably associated with men because of the things about knights ( mostly men). However honour and kindness can come from any gender. Opening doors for girfriend, wife or any other woman is an act of kindness.And wife taking care of me when I am ill is also kindness.

I have seen as much kindness as hatred in my life.

Thus in my opinion Chivalry by any other name is still alive even though knights who gave a name to it no longer exist.

Lori 1857 pts moderator

blogaks Hi Ashvini! I agree, "honour and kindness can come from any gender"! That's a liberating thought, isn't it ;-)

My latest conversation: What Offends You?

Vidya Sury 36 pts

@Lori I like to call this care/affection/courtesy all mixed together. I am completely impressed by it because it is such an instant feel-gooder! And yes, I also like to believe it comes naturally - like the ten year old kid in my apartment complex who was playing with his friends and saw me trudging up with both hands holding bags, he dropped his bat and rushed over to open the door of the elevator so I didn't have to free my hands to do it. He didn't worry that he lost a chance to bat in his game. My son does a lot of minor things I hate to do - and that makes my heart so full.

I really enjoyed this post!

Lori 1857 pts moderator

Vidya SuryLori Hi Vidya! I like how you say you are "completely impressed by" chivalry! We are especially touched when these small acts of courtesy come from young people. Your story of the ten-year old who helped you with your bags is so sweet. These caring acts touch us because they're unexpected and not necessary. They're just a hopeful glimpse of the future!

It's nice to see you here Vidya!

JimK 109 pts

This is such a good article Lori. I read in the Toronto Sun on Wednesday, that just 56% of women expect a man to open a door for her. As Hiten Vyas has stated, I also do these things on instinct. Teaching your children to respect people is where it all begins. By the way, that is good of your son to lend you his coat for kneeling on. You have obviously raised him well and must be very proud of him.

Lori 1857 pts moderator

JimK Hi Jim! You ad Hiten and others here who have said chivalry comes naturally may be the last of your kind, but I sure hope not! I didn't teach my son to do what he did that day. He doesn't even recall doing it. I did teach him, like KDillabough and galenpearl to open doors and other things as I thought of them. I'm surprised that only 56% of women expect a man to open a door for her. I wonder what percentage hope they will. Expecting and hoping are two different things, but if expectations are low, it's a sad sign of the times. I'd like to think respect and chivalry were more closely linked. But it's not a gender thing. I hold the door for the person who is coming in behind me whether they are male or female. And I have to say, I'm surprised and touched when someone holds a door for me to go ahead of them.

JimK 109 pts

LoriKDillaboughgalenpearl I was surprised at that too Lori. 56% is way too low. Is it a sign of the times? Is everyone so mobile and in such a hurry that they don't have time for the least amount of chivalry? Last year I was going into a mall and holding a door for a lady who was some ten feet behind me. A man professionally dressed, without even a word cut her off and rushed in ahead of her through the door. The lady thanked me anyway and we wished each other a good day.

KDillabough 1076 pts

JimKLorigalenpearl That's what we do. We can't affect the behaviour of others who are too self-absorbed and downright rude to see what's going on around them, but we can continue to do the little things that make someone's day:) To opening doors! (in every sense of the word)

Hiten Vyas 19 pts

It's very much alive. When it comes to opening doors and allowing ladies to order food first and so on; well these are things I usually do by instinct. To me, it's just being a gentleman. I know there is perception that some ladies find this offensive. However, I've never experienced this. I've always done such things in the past, and always expect to do such things in the future!

Lori 1857 pts moderator

Hiten Vyas Hi Hiten! I'm glad to hear chivalry, loving acts, is not a thing of the past! How did you learn these manners? Did your parents teach you? I wonder why they seem to come so "naturally" to some and not so to others.

Hiten Vyas 19 pts

Lori

Hi Lori, I think I probably did learn it from my parents. For those who find it hard to do, they can always learn! But they have to be willing to do so!

Thanks for the question Lori.

Lori 1857 pts moderator

Hiten Vyas Willing yes, and know that, at least according to the people here, it is much smiled upon!

Yu think you learned it from your parents. Do you think young people can learn chivalry from movies and TV programs?

Hiten Vyas 19 pts

Lori Hi Lori,

Yes sure, I think people could learn chivalry from movies and TV programs. These can be used for good causes, in addition to just being entertainment sources!

Lori 1857 pts moderator

Hiten Vyas Ha ha,"good causes" - Yes! We totally forgot about schools! I wonder how teaching chivalry fits into the school curricula. I'm guessing it doesn't.

Hiten Vyas 19 pts

Lori Hi Lori, I like the way your mind works! Very creative. :-) There's so many things that should be on the curricula at school but isn't.

amy4leaf 11 pts

I never knew how important chivalry was to me until I met my fiancé.

He always puts me on the side of the street away from cars.

He always opens my car door for me.

He always lets me order first at restaurants.

I more or less believed that chivalry was dead, and always longed for that same quality that my Dad treats my Mom with. I am so grateful to have found someone that makes it a priority. It humbles me every time that a man like him would put me first.

I say, if chivalry is dying, let me at it! I know CPR! ;)

Lori 1857 pts moderator

amy4leaf Hi Amy! What a beautiful confirmation that chivalry is NOT dead! I love that you saw it with your parents and possibly then expected it, or hoped to find it, in your partner? They're little things but they mean a lot.

I think as long as there is ONE chivalrous man alive, we won't declare it dead - what do you think?

Welcome to Life, for instance!

Sabrina at MyMiBoSo 69 pts

It's alive and well! My boyfriend gives me every last bite - no matter how hungry he is :).

In turn I surprise him with random (ok pre-planned but random to him!) acts of kindness throughout the day.

We're chivalrous to one another - going above and beyond as reminders to each other how happy we are to be a part of each other's lives.

Lori 1857 pts moderator

MyMiBoSo Hi Sabrina! "reminders to each other how happy we are to be a part of each other's lives." This could be a definition for the new word we are instituting in place of chivalry, "loving acts", as Riley named it. Going above and beyond! Thanks for this eloquent description of chivalry!

EnsoJourney 15 pts

Chivalry is not dead. There are few of us who still value it and try hard to keep it moving forward. but as you said Lori, it's hard to teach. It's not easy to teach something that comes from the hard. That's why it's so difficult to transfer that kind of actions. Hopefully your post can remind a lot of men about it. :)

Lori 1857 pts moderator

EnsoJourney Hi Alejandro! Do you have sons? Have you tried to teach them chivalry? Funny, this morning I was in town and after our discussion here I was so much more aware of chivalry, both from men and women. I have a feeling it's contagious too - someone holds a door for you and you're more likely to hold a door for the next person.

Yvonne Root 28 pts

No, chivalry is not dead. Some men are confused. But, I believe that is because the fair maidens have confused them. At any rate, there is a wonderful site headed by a gentleman (notice the word, gentleman) whose goal it is to give knights some modern day training about being chivalrous. Brett and his wife, Kate have put together a rather remarkable site called The Art of Manliness.

Another reason I have for believing in the white knight is I married him. :)

StaceyMJHughes 441 pts

yvonne, that is a great website, I just took a quick look, but it seems to have some interesting things on it - thanks for sharing! I agree that we women (or rather SOME women) cloud the waters of chivalry!

Lori 1857 pts moderator

Yvonne Root That is a cool site Yvonne - thanks for sharing it! Aw - you married the white knight - too? ;-) Isn't it nice? I don't know why, maybe it's wired into our brains or hidden in our genes, but chivalry does feel nice. :-)

DeliberateBlog 107 pts

Ok, I'm totally with KDillabough. Chivalry and chauvinism are NOT the same thing. Women who are offended by a guy holding the door open for them are battling their own insecurities. They feel weak and the act triggers this feeling within them. A truly chauvinistic guy won't hold the door open for you. He doesn't like women enough to do that.

Kaarina, your husband and son sound like a dream. Good for you. I love it when men perform these small acts of kindness (and always silently thank their mothers for teaching them manners). And yes, this stuff is sexy. I guess it goes back to neanderthal times - we like to think, even just theoretically, that a man will "take care" of us. We don't need him to hunt down Sabertooth tigers for us anymore, but when a man gives you his jacket (providing warmth or "shelter") or walks closest to the curb (protecting you from danger) or gives up the good thin mint (ensures you have proper, um, nutrition), I believe it actually triggers something primal in us. It makes us feel safe.

So, chivalry is actually a biological impulse which one could posit ensures the survival of the species. Best argument for manners EVER. :)

Hugs!

Melody

Lori 1857 pts moderator

DeliberateBlogKDillabough So even though there aren't any knights in shining armor anymore, our modern day chivalry provides, at least symbolically, what women have always expected and received from men, making it feel "natural"?

And if by ensuring the survival of the species, you mean women are more drawn to men who provide protection, shelter and nutrition, even metaphorically, then I agree - best argument for manners for sure!

So if it's between two men - one, well, chivalrous and the other - not....?

StaceyMJHughes 441 pts

that's such a good point Melody, an instinct that makes us kind, considerate persons who appreciate loving acts.

KDillabough 1076 pts

DeliberateBlog LOVE this comment Melody:)

WGB2U 205 pts

Hello Lori!

Funny, but this was the EXACT conversation at my dinner table last night! I had two instances that occurred yesterday in which I was left hopelessly feeling that chivalry was all but dead!! I think I would crawl through broken glass to have chivalry alive and thrive in this day and age! I think chivalry base is courtesy, so woman can be chivalrous in their own way as well - towards the elderly, children, other women. I was discussing with my mother how confused men must be in this day and age because of the mixed messages of now going on over 40+ years. There's a deeper discussion to be had here, but I'm not going to there. I'm really, really old school here (but wasn't always!). I think it's in a man's make-up - his nature to want to be chivalrous. I also think society has stripped them of this role and then cries foul. To allow a man to be chivalrous is actually quite a selfless gift and one that is appreciated ten-fold. I've been greatly discouraged at the lack of chivalry, but reading some of the comments here, well, I smile with hope in my heart. Great topic my friend – love it!!

Lori 1857 pts moderator

WGB2U Hi Elena! That must have been some dinner conversation! I wish I'd have been there! I'm with you on the thought that men must be confused these days. Perhaps they have to be more subtle, more creative with their chivalry? And why just men or women too - why not everyone holding doors for the one coming behind as you walk into a store? we're all in this together - and a little kindness goes a LONG way. Just a smile of acknowledgement can completely transform a persons day. ;-)

WGB2U 205 pts

Lori

You're so correct Lori - it's sooo easy and courtesy and kindness are a beauuuutiful thing!

StaceyMJHughes 441 pts

Exactly - I think we should see it as kindness, sweetness to all fellow human beings!

StaceyMJHughes 441 pts

WGB2U Elena, you are so right, how confusing we have made things for guys! I hope it doesn't deters the good ones :)

HerSparkle 30 pts

Lori, Such a great topic. I was smiling as I read your post and all the comments. I think just the mention of chivalry brings a warm feeling to me. For whatever reason, I tend to relate chivalry to men. I love that feeling when a man goes out of his way to take a bit of care with a lady....it's kind and sweet. I do think acts of kindness by either sex are wonderful. I consider it selflessness, kindness and care. I do think these things, while not dead, are dwindling in society today. Why? 1. It's no excuse, but the pace of our lives is ridiculous and when people are stressed, tired and overwhelmed, these social graces can suffer. 2. I think much of it is nurture (not all though, some is nature), I think mothers of the 1960's and earlier had more time and made more effort to reinforce these values and concepts throughout the raising of their children. It was expected. Are many modern moms teaching these concepts? Certainly, but some aren't - I see it at my son's school all the time. My parents were very strict, as were my husbands parents. They made sure that we were very aware of our actions with others. My husband is not macho at all, but I know he has been raised to put his lady first. It is most always evident. I am committed to teaching my son about kindness, consideration and, yes, chivalry, but I can say that we are not as strict as out parents and I wonder how that will impact his learnings.

I do think some of it is nature too. I think there are naturally empathetic boys...your son sounds like one of them. He loves you so much and is so present with you, that he naturally wants to nurture you a bit. While he has likely seen your husband care for you and treat you like a lady, that instinct also likely comes from within. He sounds like a very caring young man.

I hope that we can continue to instill these values in our children and not allow them to slip away over time.

Lori 1857 pts moderator

HerSparkle Hi Lisa - interesting focus on this - nature or nurture. I love it! How much comes from what we see modeled for us, and how much comes from inside. I think you hit the nail on the head when you said my son is naturally empathetic. But he had to be caring to be paying attention. And yes, he does see his father treat me with chivalry.

In the past perhaps these practices were instilled into children more because society had "rules" which were much more clearly defined. As I suggested earlier, I think the feminist movement blurred the lines. I guess it depends on what it is we teach. We don't have to teach actions, but instead we can impart the spirit behind the actions, values and concepts, as you have said. And this whole debate poses the question: do children do what we tell them to do or what we see them doing? What actions are they seeing?

And isn't it interesting how a conversation about chivalry to quickly turned to "acts of kindness by either sex". :-)

StaceyMJHughes 441 pts

I really think that 'actions speak louder than words' really says it all. It's important that we realize that our kids SEE how/who we are, and really the words we speak are just the icing on the cake.

StaceyMJHughes 441 pts

I think you are right. I see it in the classroom. I can tell the kids whose parents have taken the time to ensure their sons have respect for women in general. These boys are a pleasure to teach, even when they are annoying and obnoxious (if that makes sense).. haha...

galenpearl 45 pts

I hear two themes in your post and in the comments. One is focused on chivalry's evolution in modern times, but still referring to the way a man treats a woman. I like KDillabough's distinction between chivalry and chauvinism. The other is about thoughtfulness, courtesy, and kindness that is not gender specific.

Regarding chivalry, I like to be treated as a woman by a chivalrous man. I might use the word gentleman to describe such a man. My feminist sensibilities can tell the difference between a man with good manners and a man who is being condescending.

My two sons are both autistic, but I taught them to hold the door open for a lady. That's the first theme. I taught all my kids, the girls and the boys, to give up their seats on the bus to anyone who needed it. That's the second theme.

Lori 1857 pts moderator

galenpearl Hi Galen! I too can't resist a gentleman's manners. The bus example is a good one. Funny, there is an advertisement on TV around here lately about this. The stress the fact that this type of courtesy is so uncommon by having the characters shout rather than speak. The pregnant lady who is given a seat by a stranger says she might name her child after him ;-) Surely things aren't that bad!

So you taught your sons to open doors for a lady! It's not in the parenting books, is it? We figured that out on our own! (Hmm... that SHOULD be in parenting books! Did I miss it?)

galenpearl 45 pts

Lori I began by teaching them to open the door for me! Teaching our kids to respect us is maybe the first step. Maybe we should write our own parenting book!

Lori 1857 pts moderator

galenpearl That would be SO MUCH fun! I agree, you can teach actions (opening the door), but to impart values (respect) is so much more effective!

StaceyMJHughes 441 pts

Galen, I think you are right, it's about what we teach our children, but I think we should concentrate on the 'holding the door' for whomever may be coming through the door. (which I'm sure you've done)...human respect, and kindness...goes a long ways.

TheJackB 1503 pts

I have an ongoing fight with a friend about who gets to walk closest to the curb. I have had to move her twice. I don't fear my mother but dammit, I am not going to get lectured about where I should be standing. ;)

My latest conversation: Blogging Should Be Like Great Sex- Fun!

Lori 1857 pts moderator

TheJackB So are you trying to push her out or in to the curb Jack? ;-) Do you know why this action is chivalrous? It has something to do, I believe, with the reason men wore big hats at that time.

Where does your mother want you to stand?

WGB2U 205 pts

LoriTheJackB

This is funny to me because I'm completey deaf in my left ear and partially in my right, so my preference is to always stand on the side closest to the curb or else I don't talk at at all or the other person talks and I ignore them. ;) Works to my benefit sometimes.

bdorman264 1935 pts

WGB2ULoriTheJackB It depends on who is talking whether I can hear or not.........:)

TheJackB 1503 pts

Lori Of course, I force her to walk in the street and sing my praises. ;)

My latest conversation: Blogging Should Be Like Great Sex- Fun!

Lori 1857 pts moderator

TheJackB Ha ha! And I saw you as SUCH a gentleman Jack, cleaning the stores out of their Valentine chocolates and lavishing the women in your life, your mom included, with candy and flowers on Valentines Day.. ;-)



Designed with Thesis by BRYAN CROMLISH

Creative Commons License| Life, for instance